Best of Reddit Experiments: Ferment Updates
TL;DR: I decided to try an entirely fermented routine (apart from actives and SPF, I may yet try SPF). This is a compilation of the quarterly follow-up posts, including longer term reflections and products I've tried since
Link to the original all ferment routine blog post.
This is a best of the updates but leaving out most of the updates on the original routine, as I basically moved on immediately to new shiny and this post is already super long! However, if anyone wants the updates on the original routine, I can post them separately - just let me know in the comments.
The original update posts included thoughts on the tested products as I had used them longer - for example, a product might have multiple further updates across the different posts. To make it easier to digest, I've put them together, noting the date on each.
You'll notice that the reviews become seriously more luxe-heavy as time goes on. Most of them were sample sachets or mini bottles for reference.
Also, I have included my "glow testing" rationale because it's something I did for a few months (to see if new products were glowy or not). But it ended up making me sad because I had to give up every other glowy product - essentially my whole usual routine - and go back to basic products. I didn't enjoy that at all.
Note: I've also deleted any that I got through the paid blog so there are some gaps, as those products don't belong on this blog.
In this post:
- All products tested list
- A note on glow testing
- Further reflections on longer term ferment usage
- Product reviews by quarter
All products tested
November 2022
- Secret Key Rose Starting Treatment Essence
- iUnik Rose Galactomyces Synergy Serum
- Hada Labo Gokujyun Premium Lotion
- Beauty of Joseon Ginseng Essence Water
- Sooryehan The Black Serum
- Missha Artemisia Calming mist
February 2023
- Hakutsuru Daiginjo Medicated Sake Whitening Lotion
- Mixsoon Bifida Toner
- Abib Rice jelly overnight mask
- Sooryehan Ginseng First Essence
May 2023
- Numbuzin No 3 Super Glowing Essence Toner
- Sooryehan Chunsam Golden Cleansing Foam
- Sooryehan Bon Firming cream
- Sooryehan Hyobidam Fermented Toner
- Sooryehan Hyobidam Fermented Emulsion
- Sooryehan Spring-Water Cream
- The History of Whoo Ultimate Rejuvenating Balancer (Cheonyuldan?)
- Sulwhasoo Snowise Brightening Water Lotion
- The History of Whoo Bichup First Moisture Anti Aging Essence
- The History of Whoo Gongjinhyag Seol Radiant White Balancer
- Decorte Hydra Clarity Treatment Essence Water
- Sooryehan Chunsam Seonyu Repairing toner
- Sulwhasoo Timetreasure Honorstige Serum
- Sulwhasoo Timetreasure Invigorating serum
A note on glow testing, because my approach has changed
I should say a bit about my method here because it might not be what you would do!
I use a lot of silicone-based moisturisers and sunscreens - these make my skin a bit shiny so I don't look at whether my skin glows after I've applied the product I'm testing. It's hard to tell what glows with the shininess, because the glow is there but the silicone shine is noticeable. There are products that don't make my skin shine (no silicones) but they also cause glow 😂
To pass the glow test, I apply the product and then my skin must glow after I've washed and dried my skin in the following routine. To attempt some degree of consistency, I check my skin in the bathroom mirror (no natural light). I live in a house that has windows in every room now so this wouldn't even be possible!
My usual glow testing process is to wait until my skin stops glowing and then test the product. However, I waited three days after using Missha Time Revolution Artemisia Treatment Essence and my skin still glowed a little. Before, three days was the maximum glow time for this product before my skin stopped glowing.
I figure my skin just always glows a bit now? It could be because I've introduced AHAs and retinal since I did the full ferment routine. I don't want to stop those or wait a whole week to see if my skin stops glowing with no glowy products.
Part of the issue is that I really miss my fuller routine when I'm glow testing. It's boring just using Cezanne, Cosrx 96, The Ordinary Natural Moisturising Factors and Illiyoon ATO Ceramide Concentrate Cream / Hada Labo Koi-Gokujyun Perfect Gel plus one glowy product. My skin starts suffering and gets more red, plus, even after a week, I may still find that my skin glows because of the actives.
So: a product gets a glowy rating if it pushes my glow beyond the minimal glow, which is probably my baseline now. I did rate products in terms of how much glow they produced, but now I'll say if it pushes my glow beyond the baseline. As I mentioned, I did stop doing this after a while but the notes are included up to when I stopped.
Reflections on longer term ferment usage
November 2022
I'm still hooked! I can't imagine a routine without some kind of ferment and I'm very keen to test more products.
I've got a lot of ferments leftover from my various routines, so I don't need any new ones, I've got lots of use up. But, sometimes I just randomly buy more ferment - like my semi-impulse purchase of Hakutsuru Daiginjo Sake Lotion.... Ha! And yet I've purchased soooo many since.
Missha Artemisia is (was) probably my favourite product of them all. It has the nicest sensorial benefits and I've found other creams and serums that I prefer to what was in the ferment routine.
February 2023
It's still awesome! Am I ever gonna change my mind about this?! Is this section even worthwhile? Feedback welcome!
The resilience continues: I've been cautious about actives in the past. Now I just slather them on! I'm only partly joking about this and further disclaimer: this is just my experience, I'm not suggesting this would be right for anyone else!
I've recently been glow testing so no ferment and I've definitely noticed some backsliding in my neck resilience. My face has been fine but I did have drop AHAs, given that they glow too (see below for more info on this).
In my routine at present: glycolic acid (7%), glycolic & lactic acid (4% each, I'll finish this this product soon, edit: finished, replaced with 5% AHA *with ferment!*) betaine salicylate (4%) salicylic acid (0.5%), retinal (0.05%), an unknown but presumably small amount of both tranexamic acid and a vitamin c derivative (not because I was looking for those, it was nice bonus because I wanted the ferment loveliness of the Hakutsuru, discussed below). My routine of actives is fickle, for a while I barely used them although retinal is still around and Minimalist 10% AHA BHA serum. Currently just Minimalist 2% Salicylic Acid and 20% vitamin c. I'm probably going to ditch them altogether for a while once I've used them up, apart from the SA, that is necessary for my pores!
May 2023
I'm not using anything from the original line up apart from Beauty of Joseon Radiance cleansing balm, Missha Artemisia Calming essence and Dr Ceuracle Kombucha essence now. I strongly doubt I will repurchase any of the original products (apart from the Missha and maybe Dr Ceuracle mentioned above) because of my Sooryehan obsession that's grown to outrageous proportions in the last few months. I did purchase the Missha and the Dr Ceuracle.
Every time I use something that's not Sooryehan, I'm unimpressed. Well, unless it's from The History of Whoo or Sulwhasoo. But it's Sooryehan that I like the best, even if I prefer the fragrance in Whoo or Sulwhasoo. Well, there are other products I like that aren't luxe but Sooryehan is by far my favourite brand.
August 2023
I don't think I posted the August 2023 or just wrote it on Reddit which I've since deleted 🤷🏻♀️
Product reviews November 2022
Update: SK-II FTE - did I notice any additional benefits, like redness reduction, over my other FTEs?
I felt I did when I tested it for a month and it was my only ferment then so perhaps I was getting general ferment benefits? In the retest, I had enough for 2 weeks, stopped all other ferment and no difference noticed in redness. But I think 2 weeks isn't long enough to test this aspect of it.
I will say generally my skin is calmer when I use a lot of ferment anyway. I'm not rushing to repurchase the FTE when I could use that money to try lots of other ferments, because everything I've tried since has worked to a greater or lesser degree! Ah, that calmer thing again...
Update: Dr Ceuracle Kombucha essence
The second product from the original ferment routine that I'm still using. Not much to add except that it still does exactly what I want it to: hydrate, moisturise a bit and gloooooow! It's a great all rounder, especially for drier skin.Really nice product, fun to shake but a bit pricey. Ok so I know that's a bit of a ridiculous comment to make when my face routine is all luxe but my neck just needs lots of moisturising. I probably won't repurchase, La Roche Posay 20% Shea butter body lotion is the best thing I've found for my neck. Oh and Stradia Lipid Gold, thank you AB Muse!
Secret Key Rose Starting Treatment Essence
I said: it's great! HG!
My only issue is that I find galactomyces sometimes irritate my neck, so I drop this from routine if my neck is irritated. Thankfully, I have plenty of other ferments :) it's a solid medium glow and I'm very happy with it. Didn't repurchase.
iUnik Rose Galactomyces Synergy serum
I said: iUnik is a low glow but noticeable.
And I haven't used it since, mostly because I've been testing other things and it was a bit foolish to buy a product that's really similar to the Secret Key (but less effective), at the same time as the Secret Key. Lol. It's only a mini, though, so it's not a big deal. Didn't repurchase.
Hada Labo Gokujyun Premium Lotion
I said: If all you care about is hydration and you don't have lots of other Hyaluronic Acid products, this is great! It can break out people with acne-prone skin and it has some ferment, so the usual ferment caveats of patch test carefully apply. However, for me, the only drawback is it can be very shiny with other HA products. I just don't care enough to not use it and I'd drop other products over this every day of the week.
I had said I wasn't going to glow test it but I have! One layer applied and yes, it does increase my glow beyond baseline. I don't think I repurchased this. Or did I? I'm not using it now.
Beauty of Joseon Ginseng Essence Water
I've previously said this doesn't glow for me. And it didn't when I applied one layer. But I know some people have found that products get really glowy if you layer them up. So I did three layers and I got a glow! I got this for free but previously I bought it.
Compared to FTEs, this is easier to apply, because it's more viscous. I'm glad it glows because it's pretty cheap (ignoring the fact I got it for free, it's still much cheaper than a lot of FTEs generally).
So, new rule: if something doesn't glow, try 3 layers (if it's not gonna be really sticky. This wasn't sticky applied as my first step after cleansing but I can imagine Hada Labo Premium lotion getting sticky if I tried to do multiple layers). I didn't repurchase.
Sooryehan The Black Serum
This is one of the fanciest products I've bought! Sure, it's only a set of samples but it's still fancy! It is also fragranced - I haven't found it irritates my skin.
In fact, my skin looks calmer after I used it and my skin tone looked more even, which is really excellent because I've been getting a bit disheartened - I can't use a lot of my normal calming products when I'm glow testing because most of them are glowy! I didn't expect that from a serum with fragrance so it must be a kind of fragrance that doesn't irritate my skin. The first time I used it, I thought it was cosmetically elegant. The second time, I made a user error and applied it after Cosrx 96. Mistake! My face was really sticky.
Warning: flights of fancy coming up!
The third time, I decided to treat this serum like the (relatively) premium product it is: I very gently pressed it into my skin, then kept pressing and massaging very gently for five or ten minutes. Wow, I felt relaxed, the fragrance enveloped my senses: I could have been walking in a forest with lots of night blooming flowers (I'm pretty sure that's not a thing but night blooming flowers is what the scent makes me think of), it's a cool summer night and there's soft grass beneath my feet...
Update: May 2023
This is a staple for me! I previously said how much I like this and what a great experience I had with it: particularly because it was one of my first fragranced products and it smells amazing.I didn't t mention The Black Serum in my Feb update because I hadn't been using it regularly. I ordered more sachets and I've been using it nightly (more or less) since mid-March and I absolutely miss it whenever I don't use it. I used to sometimes skip it because I like to wait 30 mins as per AB Muse regarding the glowy effects from waiting 30 mins plus before moving on with my routine
Link to AB Muse's post: luxe serum smackdown
It's impossible to choose my favourite Sooryehan product and I absolutely can't but this was the first product, next to the Bon Firming cream, that I decided would have a perma-spot in my routine. I like the silicones, I like the oil (it doesn't have oil, I was mistaken), I love how it dries down and gives me a very smooth surface for the rest of my products. That's one of the things I love the most about the premium products (apart from the effect on how my skin looks) is how they dry to ultra smoothness. And all my subsequent products just glide on and feel amazing. Still true, even better with other siliconey Sooryehan and Whoo products.
Update: August 2023
Delightful and effective for calming my skin, YMMV ofc! It absolutely adds some hydration, moisturising effects and some occlusiveness (occlusivity? I like that form of the word, even if it's not real). The fragrance is lovely. The packaging looks great, although I've only been using samples so far.But yes, calming is a major aspect of this serum for me: my skin not only prone to baseline redness, it is highly reactive to the environment, both internally and externally (I blush with emotion, I flush with heat - even cups of tea do it lol and just general redness abounds).
Anything that reduces my baseline unevenness in any way is worth the money! Particularly as no other product has managed that so far.
I find consistency of use matters for this serum and its calming effects. My whole Whoo routine, mentioned above, leaves my skin less calm so I naturally added The Black Serum back in and now things are better!
As I said in my review of The Black Serum on my blog, I'm noticing an ever more evening of my skin tone generally that I think is a result of consistent use of The Black Serum plus the Whoo Seol balancer, which I talked about earlier. It's slow work and if I stop The Black Serum, as I did for a week, my skin loses progress even though it's becoming more even generally. The Black Serum is a win: it needs to be in my routine going forward, whatever else I might change. It's so interesting to have confirmation that this product genuinely makes a difference (beyond the usual hydration and moisturising benefits). So many repurchases! Full size also purchased, more on this in my updated review.
Missha Artemisia Calming mist
Oh how I love a mist for easy application! And I don't love this spray bottle! Grr. It's got an annoying deodorant aerosol top and I sprayed it gently, which gives a very wide spray of big droplets, not a mist! Grrrrr.
A harder press gives a better mist effect. I will experiment with how much pressure to use. The hardest press gives the best mist and I'm pleased with it - so, user error.
It doesn't taste nice. I'm sure the original tasted better. Nope: original doesn't taste better.
Yes: it does push my glow above baseline, 2-3 layers used but that's not equivalent to 2-3 layers applied by hand from the original in the bottle. The mist doesn't dispense very much product so I need to do two layers to get a comparable amount to one wet layer from the original bottle.
I'm slightly irritated by this product so I'm testing my other products instead, a week for each as I've broken out from using one new product a night for like 6 nights when glow testing. At least it's just CCs...
All this might be unnecessary for some people, I'm noticing progress! I'm older so my collagen production is going to be lower than someone in their 20s, which would explain the progress from incorporating multiple actives.
Update: Aug 2023
Yep, still loving this, although it always seems to be a bit on the pricey side now, Stylevana doesn't have it for cheap anymore, although I haven't checked regularly.Strongly considering moving on, especially because it seems shea butter is the thing needed for my neck to getting rid of irritation. However, I do miss the Missha when I don't use it and I'm all about skincare joy right now - it brings me joy so maybe I'll just carry on, despite the cost 🤷🏻♀️ or not! Stay tuned for future episodes of procrastination! As mentioned above, I did repurchase the essence but unlikely to do so again. My neck doesn't really benefit from it and my face wants thicker, more luxurious things!
Product reviews February 2023
I haven't tried many new ferment products recently - I'm slacking!
Hakutsuru Daiginjo Medicated Sake Whitening Lotion
I cannot say how much I love this but I'll try :)
Also, don't get too excited about this one: u/PeachBlossomBee has discovered that it's been discontinued 😭it is still available in some places but not from amazon.jp to the UK and shipping from Kirei Station to the UK is actually a lot more than I had hoped 😞
Glow comes first because it's the most important! It glows nicely. Gooood because it's the cheapest glow product I've used yet! I also love the additional ingredients of tranexamic acid and a vitamin c derivative. Plus, fermented rice is one of my top favourite ferments 💕
The blue bottle is gorgeous! On the one hand, I love the pump. On the other, it tends to squirt! I cup my hand around it and that mostly prevents dousing the floor with it.
It feels silky smooth - a little oily but still watery. I muchly enjoy the slightly oily feeling in the colder weather. I figure it will still be fine for summer but I'll need to test it. I
It is very hydrating imo and I particularly like doing more than one layer, although I've got so many products open that I tend to just do one. I both enjoy and am slightly ashamed of how many products I have open!
I think it helps a little with my dark circles, which are from lack of sleep. It helps a lot with the purple pigment around my lips - I haven't tried a lot of products on this, as I don't wanna burn my lips off. I've noticed the purple seems to come back when I don't use it / or when I don't use it (for glow testing other products), the leftover pigment becomes more noticeable🤷🏻♀️
Either way, I figure it's the tranexamic acid that's having the effect on pigmentation and I'll be strongly considering a TxA product when I've finished it (I've still got 2/3 of the bottle so no worries about this any time soon). And I'm going to keep my eyes open for a rice ferment with txa. I haven't found anything yet but I'll keep looking!
Before learning it was discontinued: Total win, I'll definitely repurchase!
Update: May 2023
In all honesty, I have binned this. There's nothing wrong with the product, apart from it being discontinued, but it's too awkward to move house with. The fact that it's discontinued made me decide to draw a line under it, as much as I love it.
Mixsoon Bifida Toner
Whilst it's not very hydrating - quite often single extract products aren't IME - I like a single extract at the start of my routine. Missha Artemisia (old bottle, new mist) is definitely a touch more hydrating than any other single extract I've tried but not by much.
I'll apply several layers of a single extract and my skin will get a little hydration and hopefully some benefits from the extract itself. I find my toner applies better after using a single extract product first.
The jury is out on whether I'll find this irritating for my neck long term but Missha Artemisia and I'm From Mugwort essence never caused any issues so I expect the problem with the One Thing was their extraction method.
It's not centella itself because I've tried other high content centella products (like Skin1004 100% Centella amouple and Mary & May Centella serum) with no issues. The Mixsoon Bifida does glow but not very much.
This is one of the lowest glow products I've used - and I did three generous layers.
Glowometer: 2 routines after ceasing glowy products, my skin registered 29 lx, 3 routines: 15 lx, 4 routines: 7 lx. The cleanse after applying Mixsoon: 8-12 lx and looking at my skin in the mirror agrees with said reading. So it's not a major win but hopefully it will have some barrier building properties with longer usage.
Update May 2023
Well, I like this, it's cheap ish, it's basic. My favourite way to use it is on a bamboo reusable pad after I cleanse with micellar water. I've finished it and I probably won't repurchase it just for that. This will be a common refrain but premium has made me rethink products like this. Prescient.
Abib Rice Probiotics Overnight Barrier Mask Jelly
Firstly, the packaging! Not only does it come with a spatula, joy, there's a special bit in the lid to keep it in place! With the various discounts on Stylevana, this moisturiser was £11.70. So it's not like it costs lots more than Cosrx 92 and yet the Abib has a spatula and a special place for it. Plus anyone else noticed that Cosrx 92 screw top lids seems a bit cheaper feeling than the previous one from a year ago?
Anyway, rants and raves about packaging aside, this is a literal jelly. It's like the Benton Real Cool Aloe Soothing gel but with a tiny bit more structure. I just looked at the ingredients again: no occlusives as far as I can see. How is this gonna stop TEWL?! Where's the emollients?? I need to stop getting excited about fun sounding ferments at good prices and pay proper attention to ingredient lists 🤦🏻♀️
Even Isntree Hyaluronic Acid Water Sleeping mask has an emollient (a silicone). I'll test it in various ways and with various products but I don't have high hopes. Maybe it'll work fine as a first moisturiser.
First test: as a day cream. Yeah yeah, I know that's not what it's for but I use all my last steps / sleeping masks AM too. Lol. They all have different degrees of shininess plus I don't really care if I look shiny. I just want maximum occlusiveness all the time but in a thick moisturiser / mask form. I'll use Aquaphor if I must but usually it's not necessary because of all of the sleeping masks. Because of the lack of occlusives, I used my heaviest sunscreen and it pilled (I did use a serum with oil so that might have something to do with it) So: probably not a day time option. I was just excited to use it 🤣
2nd test: PM, I'm not risking this as my only moisturiser. So, apply Mary & May Blackberry cream, Abib (less than I applied AM) and Hada Labo Perfect gel. Ok, so something interesting happened: the Hada Labo dried almost immediately.
Normally I have to work it into my skin for a few minutes before it dries (I've tried leaving it without massaging, it doesn't form an occlusive film that way). I am not sure if it'll properly form an occlusive film but I'll find out in the morning! Morning update: yes, seems like it formed a good occlusive film and my skin feels hydrated and very soft this morning.
Almost immediate update
Sooryehan Ginseng First Essence
I can't wait to get back to this once I've finished all my current test products! I've reviewed it here.
Link to Sooryehan Ginseng First Essence blog review
Link to Sooryehan Ginseng First Essence update blog review
And I still love it - but I stopped using it so I could test other products out. I did say I thought I'd want more hydration when I used just the Ginseng First Essence and The Black Serum as my only steps (plus sunscreen). So I strongly suspect the Ginseng First Essence plus a Sooryehan toner will work wonders (you know, once I've finished all the other sample sizes). Further updates on this will be made on my next ferment post.
Update: August 2023
This is a very nice product, I still really like it and enjoy using it. I just use it PM now, partly to speed up my AM routine, partly to make room for Melano CC and partly because I'm trying to conserve it so I don't have to buy another one too soon 😂
I use it to add hydration and for the ginseng, although I'm not sure to what extent it functions like the classic FTE where it enhances the effects / penetration of subsequent layers but is that just because it has the texture of a light serum?
I don't know.
I do enjoy the texture more than, say, the Decorte Hydra Clarity Treatment Essence Water, but that's because I've been spoiled by all the juicy thick textures of the hanbang products I've tried recently. If you've read any of my other posts, you might recall that I complain about watery textures on a regular basis.
I'm clumsy so I vastly prefer thicker textures which lead to less spillage. I've also done a very detailed review on my blog, should you want a long read :) To sum up, psychologically, I miss using this but, as I'll say, I think the all Whoo routine is better. However, as I'll also say at the end of this post, I'm going to sub products in and out so the next ferment update will report back on this. I absolutely enjoyed the all Whoo Gongjinhyang Seol Radiant White routine but it wasn't quite substantial enough for my skin and I haven't managed to write a full review of it. Yet.
Products reviews May 2023
Numbuzin No 3 Super Glowing Essence Toner
I tried the Numbuzin to see if fermented rice bran was the issue with the Abib Rice Probiotics Overnight Mask Barrier Jelly. Yeah, it seems to be the issue because I got the same kind of heavily textured CC breakout that was almost a rash. I think it probably was a rash. Shame because I enjoyed both products for their fun textures.
Sooryehan Chunsam Golden Cleansing Foam
My next blog post review will be of this. Link below.
Link to Sooryehan Chunsam Golden Cleansing Foam review
The highlights are that it smells weird to me. My partner thinks it just smells of foundation, so that's fine. I'll try a different cleanser next: although I'm noseblind to the smell now, I don't like it.
It smooths on nicely, the foam is rich and not bubbly - I definitely enjoy the feeling of it. There was a moment of panic as you begin to dilute and rinse it: my skin starts to feel squeaky clean, almost dried out. However, once my skin had dried, it was super soft and comfy, no squeaky clean aftermath. Confounding! It's my favourite cleanser now, I'll be sad when I run out.
Cleansing is boring for me so it's hard to contemplate spending the money for a premium cleanser, especially when I've got others to use up. I will use up the others, begrudgingly, and be glad when I can purchase my next cleanser from a premium range. I may try something from Whoo or Sulwhasoo if I can find a sample size from those easily but I expect I'll try to find a Sooryehan cleanser.
Update: August 2023
Kind of an update? It's well over 9 months past expiry so I stopped using it on my face. However, I keep it because it's amazing for removing ink and hair dye stains from my hands. I would still use it but the smell is a little different from when I first got it so I don't want to risk it on my face! And I didn't like the smell in the first place 😂 It's not super relevant but the Sooryehan Bon Foaming Cleanser was drying with the hard water and my new dry skin. I was very disappointed about it.
Sooryehan Bon Firming cream
I've written an extensive review on my blog.
Link to Sooryehan Bon Firming cream blog review
Link to Sooryehan Bon Firming cream update blog review
I received this at the beginning March ish, so it missed the cut off for the Feb update. The Bon Firming cream has been my go-to ever since I started it at the beginning of March.
I find it utterly wonderful - it's a delight to use and it hasn't failed me in any situation yet. The test will be full summer to see how it does with more serious weather: heat and humidity, which results in a layer of sweat even as I'm applying skincare.
Most of my creams failed last year, apart from the Hada Labo Perfect Gel. The Sooryehan dries down in a similar manner to the Hada Labo and it's coped with rain and sweat all at once so far without becoming an emollient mess mixed with sweat. The Hada Labo requires massaging in until it's almost dry, which is time consuming. However, if you don't do this, it's likely to pill with sunscreen. Not good any time but especially bad in summer.
I've had no issue with the Sooryehan pilling. I'm trialling it on my neck, as my neck is far more prone to sunscreen pilling than my face. Stay tuned for updates! I full on love it and have repurchased to make sure I don't run out of it. Apparently I was done with updates after this! I didn't recall trying it in the morning - my memory is terrible. I've noted it was a bit shiny the summer of 2023.
Sooryehan Hyobidam Fermented Toner
Somehow, using Sooryehan's Ginseng First Essence didn't prepare me for the texture of this toner. It's thicker than some of the Beauty of Joseon serums! I started to think all non-moisturiser premium products were basically serums. Not that I mind that but I don't associate that texture with hydration. However, I am pleased to say that these associations have proven baseless and I'm slowly adapting to a new way of thinking: hydration doesn't have to be thin products. Sure, there have always been thicker products that are hydrating: Cosrx 96 and Isntree Hyaluronic Acid Water essence are cases in point.
However: toner feels like it should be thinner to be hydrating, in my mind, because most of them are much thinner, so it's an association based on the kinds of toner textures that are common. If you've followed any of my serieses, you may recall I'm a clumsy person and frequently lament thinner products (because I spill, often).
So actually, once I got over the toners are thin paradigm, I was rewarded because this product is lovely. The fragrance isn't as nice as the ones from Whoo but that's ok.
I'm inclined, as always, to go with Odile Monod on this: Sooryehan benefits from the research done for the Whoo brand and whilst the ingredients aren't as premium as Whoo, it's a great entry level option and still uses better quality ingredients than a lot products.
Link to Odile's video on traditional Korean anti-aging skincare on a budget
I think the Hyobidam range is sort of middling for Sooryehan. There's cheaper products like the Water Spring line and more expensive ones like the Chunsam range.
For example, on Jolse, the Water Spring emulsion is about $32 (full price, at time of writing $27), Hyobidam $52 (full price, at the time of writing $44) and Chunsam (Heaven Grade, pretty sure this is Chunsam) $52 (full price, at the time of writing $46) I've chosen emulsions because Jolse doesn't carry toners beyond the Hyobidam. For reference, a full size Hyobidam toner is $36 (full price, at the time of writing $30 ish)
Update: August 2023
This is a very decent toner, a contender for long term use unless the Whoo Gongjinhyang Seol line works out better (see below for more info on this).
Another thing that is not in the Sooryehan's favour is that the Whoo balancer is pretty cheap from TesterKorea right now, about half the price (nearly) of a full size Sooryehan Hyobidam toner.
Arguments for the Sooryehan is that it's a thicker texture than the Whoo so it's easier to apply - the Sooryehan is like a light serum. The Sooryehan is hydrating, a bit moisturising and works very nicely, even though I'm using Whoo more because of the effects of it with The Black Serum (they boost each other for making my skin tone look more even and calmer, although it is, so far, a temporary thing as I'll note below. Long term maybe I'll see more longer lasting benefits but for now, short term will do fine. I have completely reversed my opinion. Mutability is the only constant (the film 24 Hour Party People tells me this is Boethius but I haven't checked).
Group review of Whoo and Sulwhasoo
- The History of Whoo Ultimate Rejuvenating Balancer (Cheonyuldan?)
- Sulwhasoo Snowise Brightening Water Lotion
- The History of Whoo Bichup First Moisture Anti Aging Essence
- The History of Whoo Gongjinhyang Seol Radiant White Balancer
Ordering is least to most in all categories:
Texture (thin to thick): Sulwhasoo Snowise, Whoo Gongjinhyag, Whoo Cheonyuldan, Whoo Bichup Most hydrating: same order as above.
Most moisturising: same order as above. Lol.
Favourite scent: Whoo Gongjinhyag, Whoo Cheonyuldan, Whoo Bichup, Sulwhasoo Snowise (it's not necessarily the best but the one that appeals to me the most)
Most likely to purchase a full size: Sulwhasoo Snowise (except it is discontinued), Whoo Gongjinhyag, Whoo Bichup (doesn't win because of the price!), Whoo Cheonyuldan.
I absolutely liked the Bichup the best but I definitely have enjoyed using the Cheonyuldan - the latter with all my Sooryehan has been working really well.
I'm reluctant to actually repurchase it because I don't think I want to give up the Sooryehan (and purchasing both is just too pricey to contemplate.
Unless I get a really fancy job. If I do, I will save up some money and buy everything loool).
However, I think I'll be fine without a product from Whoo for now. I just really, really love Sooryehan so I expect I'll just add the Ginseng First Essence back in once I've moved and finished all the samples. Little did I know how dry my skin would be when I moved. So I got the Bichup full size which is much more suitable now.
Easy solution because I already have it and it will replace the Cheonyuldan so I'll be using the same amount of products and therefore I should retain the same amount of hydration hopefully. If the Ginseng First Essence really isn't as good as the Cheonyuldan, then I'll rethink.
Update: August 2023
Whoo Gongjinhyang Seol / Radiant White balancer
There was a recent post, that I didn't comment on, about whether it was worth trying an entire product line rather than mixing and matching to get a range of ingredients.I couldn't think of anything useful to say, although I could have said that, previously, I didn't think it was worth it but that I'd just ordered toner, essence, emulsion and cream (samples) all from the same line. I don't know if I'll derive any benefits from specifically using 4 products from one line but I'm keen to try. However whoo has so many ingredients so stacking their entire line might be great.
The original brief of this series was to stack ferments and do a routine composed only of products with fermented ingredients, although, granted, from different brands.I've been focusing more on the total experience of my routine of late and jettisoning products that aren't an absolute pleasure to use. The fragrance in the Sooryehan Hyobidam line is not one of which I am especially fond. I've adapted and I think the Hyobidam is much better for drier skin.
There's nothing wrong with it but I vastly prefer the fragrance in the Whoo Gongjinhyang Seol range. I also hugely enjoy using all the Whoo products together.
The Gongjinhyang Seol are generally more pricey than Sooryehan products, however, I want more Whoo in my life and the Gongjinhyang Seol is one of the lower priced Whoo ranges. I've never tried an entire set of products from the same range and I'm super intrigued.
Anyways. Back to the balancer! I love the fragrance: fresh, lime and herbal.It's not really moisturising enough with the hard water but that's ok because rest of this line because intensely moisturising! I do need 2-3 layers to get the hydrating benefits but, given my prior routine was longer, I'm not surprised at that discovery. But also, my skin got drier so....
Plus, this balancer dries quickly so doing 2-3 layers isn't arduous. Plus did I mention the hard water enough yet?! Because it's really affected my skin! I think, apart from fragrance, the Sooryehan toner is the better product but I'm trialling just using Whoo Seol / Radiant so I have to take it all in context!
On occasion, the Whoo feels a bit stingy, especially compared to the Sooryehan Hyobidam toner mentioned above. However, I'm committed to this test of all Whoo and the stinginess is pretty rare, although I find myself generally very keen to get a layer of the Whoo Seol Radiant essence on my skin either way. The Sooryehan toner is thicker and more cushiony. Whilst I vastly prefer the scent of the Whoo, I think the Sooryehan is a better fit for me. But it's early days in my Whoo test. I enjoyed this test but over a month, these products just aren't suitable for drier skin. So naturally my fine lines became more noticeable. I'm not sure that it was down to not using actives for a month, I think it was not enough hydration and moisturising.
Update: February 2024
Bichup First Moisture Anti-Aging essence on sale! Yep, works better than the Sooryehan Ginseng First Essence.
Product reviews August 2023
Decorte Hydra Clarity Treatment Essence Water
Could have sworn I talked about this before but maybe it was only on the raves/rants thread.
As a kind of FTE type product, it totally fits the bill. The smell is cool, fresh and crisp, undertones of citrus and herbal. It makes me think of the UK coast on a early spring day: there's a hint of frost on the roads, the sky is steely pale blue and the ocean has a touch of grey, rippled from the chill breeze. The tide is out and the beach stretches for what seems like miles. Might only have to do one of these every so often because that took me ages to write! 😂 Toner ).
Sooryehan Chunsam Seonyu Repairing toner
This broke me out. My first Sooryehan fail that is a confirmed fail: tried it two or three instances (with breaks and no new products between, breakouts each time). Such a shame because I really liked the smell of this and it's even thicker than the other toners I've talked about here. I'm just so on board with thick textures rn!
Sulwhasoo Timetreasure Honorstige serum
This is my favourite texture, next to the Whoo cream I'll talk about below (the Sulwhasoo loses points for the price, although I do prefer the Sulwhasoo texture above all other serums). Realistically, this is way, way, way out of budget and is it really worth it? I love the fragrance, the texture, the feel of it and the immediate effects and I've used it as a one and done, which is impressive, given how dry my skin is of late. On texture - see Rczc It's like a cream, tbh, but melts as you spread it and smooths so silkily. 90% of the time this applied so well it seemed to become one with my face in a few minutes at most. If applied too wetly or to wet skin, you'll be waiting 5-10 mins for it to dry but either a) be patient to start with and apply it relatively dry skin or b) be patient once applied.
Sulwhasoo Timetreasure Invigorating serum
I would purchase a full size but it is out of budget, especially when I love what the Whoo + The Black Serum routine is doing for my skin rn.
For the current price of one Invigorating on TesterKorea, if I add $12 extra, I get full sizes of the four Whoo products I'm using and a 90ml bottle of The Black Serum.
So I know what I'm going with for now!
But if money were no object, I'd get both Timetreasure serums to see if they gave me good effects longer term.
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